Exilian
Game Design and Project Resources: The Workshops Quarter => Tabletop Design - The Senet House => Fox Box => Topic started by: Flamekebab on February 28, 2015, 07:38:02 PM
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I've been running my own little business for a while now - Fox Box (http://fox-box.co.uk/). It started out as a bitz company specialising in Orks and whilst I don't intend to stop selling other kits as bitz I started to get interested in making my own parts. Lacking the knowledge and equipment to do my own casting I had a friend (http://hivecityterrain.co.uk/) help me with casting. That was all well and good until I moved away from Edinburgh. No longer could I walk to his flat and pick up copies.
So over the last few months I've put together my own casting rig:
(http://i.imgur.com/RLgfUzvl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/RLgfUzv.jpg)
It has a vacuum pump for pulling a strong vacuum and a hefty compressor to quickly bring it up to 60 PSI. As long as I design my mould correctly, use the right amount of resin, and don't dilly dally I can get perfect casts. That is to say no bubbles, no blisters, barely any mould lines (and often none at all - it depends on the mould design).
Here's the first mould I made, a copy of a sculpt I did:
(http://i.imgur.com/Y3sPolNl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/Y3sPolN.jpg)
It worked but turned out to be needlessly cautious. The amount of sprue is totally unnecessary for my technique, that sort of kidney.
Here's a copy from that mould:
(http://i.imgur.com/y6Z89MVl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/y6Z89MV.jpg)
Here's a shot of a couple of copies from a different mould design:
(http://i.imgur.com/hvBNQyNl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/hvBNQyN.jpg)
They were cast together in a single mould but it has its own issues (extracting from it is time sensitive - too soon and stuff bends, too late and it snaps) so I'm planning on creating a replacement for it in a bit.
More recently I've been attempting to scale up the copying of these parts:
(http://i.imgur.com/AJlqE1Rl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/AJlqE1R.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/inVSZydl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/inVSZyd.jpg)
The problem with casting is that I can do lots of resin at once, assuming I have moulds for it. Unfortunately my pressure chamber is round. It's a bit tricky to tetris stuff together and it slows things down. That might sound like a minor annoyance but 30 seconds makes all the difference when the resin only has 2 - 4 minutes until it starts to cure (the range depends on a variety of factors including temperature). If I want to degass the resin and then put pressure on it I need about two minutes, sometimes more, sometimes less.
Sooo, if I'm faffing about pouring resin into lots of little moulds that can easily take a minute to a minute and a half. Erk!
The solution? As with many other things in life, the answer is cake.
(http://i.imgur.com/knBMoNol.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/knBMoNo.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/Tt2gOVPl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/Tt2gOVP.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/RmbRaJwl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/RmbRaJw.jpg)
Well, there's also the side effect of how firmly the silicone and parts were stuck in there:
(http://i.imgur.com/3VT5BWIl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/3VT5BWI.jpg)
I've yet to put together moulds for the heads and weapons but they should be comparatively easy.
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Ooh, very nice indeed!
I'd love to try casting at some point - I'm going to make getting back into sculpting a thing over summer I hope.
So are you intending to get a few new cast kits up on the website sometime in the near future? :)
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Yep, the plan is to get these things up for sale within the next week. I'm waiting on a new batch of resin and there's a few more moulds to make but it's exciting!
Yesterday I posted some models to another Exilian member to paint for promo shots and similar. I should probably get my new goblins ready for casting too.
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It's remarkable how incompetent some couriers can be. I'm always at home yet they have the nerve to mark things as "attempted delivery" without even approaching my front door. It's a shame I cannot "attempt payment" when dealing with them...
Lack of resin aside I've been figuring out the best way to make a mould for heads and weapons, two things that would fit on a single "cake slice". I don't really want to make another cake tin full of moulds just yet. Goblins need to be corralled, space ships tidied, things like that.
So instead this mould is going to straddle the top of the cake tin, or attempt to at any rate!
(http://i.imgur.com/7MLkKeGl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/7MLkKeG.jpg)
I really hope I can get this stuff sorted soon. It's been ages since I worked on anything else!
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Would it be too prying into your trade secrets to ask what sorts of costs making a new set of figures is with this system from sculpt to production? Does the mould-making take ages/is it expensive?
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Feel free to ask but be prepared not to get a useful answer :(
I've not been doing this long enough to have the production pipeline nailed down and therefore figuring out costs is difficult. Silicone doesn't take all that long to work with (a few hours the way I'm doing things) and isn't super expensive. The problem tends to be mould design and how much silicone is going to be used in the project. How much is to be used depends on a number of factors too - obviously the size of the thing being copied but as you're seeing in my latest images it's also a matter of how many copies to be made per casting run. I have a full set of moulds to produce my Sororitas Arcanum models but they only produce one sprue per casting run.
The question is further complicated by things like how much my time is worth. It's mine to allocate and so doing work for someone else would attach a price tag to it. Some sculpts are done over a few days, others I've been working on for years. This is another area that gets tricky to pin down as I don't like to work without backups. Before I couldn't back anything up and it slowed me down. These days I can just make a quick prep mould and copy what I'm working on speeding things up massively.
If you wanted me to make copies of your sculpts it would be much easier to put a price tag on it, thankfully.
In other news apparently my package was signed for by "KEDI". I have no idea who that is. This is the second time they've done this.
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One of the best things about having in-house casting facilities is how much it speeds up creation of new masters. The original Sororitas Arcanum models were being worked on back in 2012!
Of course there was a lot more to the delay than just that but it was a major obstacle to progress. I love working on multi-part models but if every piece is a master then it can't be easily glued into place in case removing it damages it later. Getting delicate (and more importantly small) parts to fit together across several models is a bloody nightmare when it has to be done with a combination of blu-tack, superglue, and hope. That was some learning experience, I can tell you.
Anyway, back to the positive. I've been working on some multi-part weapons (as teased on the Fox Box blog (http://fox-box.co.uk/frontpage/spot-the-line-of-little-fox-heads/)) but they're going to need arms before I have a complete product.
Instead of worrying about the masters I just cast up some copies, built a few weapons, and now I'm working on the arms at a fair pace:
(http://i.imgur.com/X7BwSgRl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/X7BwSgR.jpg)
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Well some things got in the way of progress but things are getting back on track:
(http://i.imgur.com/v6hiz3bl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/v6hiz3b.jpg)
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Nice! They look like they'll separate from the mould block much more easily too which is a definite plus.
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Gobbo!
(http://i.imgur.com/61RBQFZl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/61RBQFZ.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/3hbQw3Kl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/3hbQw3K.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/aXzIDnAl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/aXzIDnA.jpg)
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That's incredible! Well done FK :D
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I've never tried model-making, and I know very little about it, but that looks very good quality.
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Thanks, guys!
Apparently Jenny has secured a batch of masters that have been trapped in limbo with my old caster up north for the last year or so. Lots of new stuff is inbound :D
In the meantime this probably doesn't look like much but it's the first cast after the initial one that worked out as planned:
(http://i.imgur.com/85FS4ACl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/85FS4AC.jpg)
When I make moulds capturing the detail is the easy bit - cutting them open in such a way as to not break the copies when they're pulled out is the hard part. I'm going to do another run tomorrow and with any luck be able to release these little badasses over the weekend:
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What are the recovered masters for? :)
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There's quite a few products that never made it to production for one reason or another. Amongst those are two sets of Orc arms and a set of legs:
(http://i.imgur.com/wBCmcB9l.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/wBCmcB9.jpg)
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Is that a "giving the finger" hand I see second from left? :P
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Most definitely!
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epic :D
brings another meaning to: the metal horde ;)
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Someone bought some goblins! Yay!
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Wunderbar :D
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Next up!
(http://i.imgur.com/bmP389Ll.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/gCvijxbl.jpg)
Bonus pic:
(http://i.imgur.com/pIWWa9Tl.jpg)
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New stuff!
(http://i.imgur.com/WDrFsfCl.jpg) (http://fox-box.co.uk/product/fox-box-orc-yob-arms-7/)
(http://i.imgur.com/W9xxS8Rl.jpg) (http://fox-box.co.uk/product/fox-box-orc-revolver-arms/)
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Phew, it's been a while. ExiliCon and related really kept me busy.
On the plus side it helped me go through my older stock and have a bit of a clear out. I'm trying to determine what's getting a remaster and when. I don't really want to drop anything from my catalogue but some things will be unavailable for a while once the remaining stock is gone.
The current priority is the Truck Extension Kit. The last units of it are gone and the old moulds need to be replaced.
Here's the masters (without the wheels):
(http://i.imgur.com/iuo6OJtl.jpg)
Mostly I'm actually quite happy with them. There's a few things I'm going to tweak or repair (the odd lost rivet here or there) but I hope to have them cast up in the next few days.
I'm excited because this was such a difficult kit to put together back in the day and it ended up costing a lot to boot (and so a high price on the store was required). These days I reckon I can probably do all the parts (except the wheels) in a single mould. That'll make casting it a breeze and allow the price to come down to much saner levels. It'll also be cast in a more well-behaved resin.
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This behind-the-scenes look is really interesting!
I'm working on painting up the gobbos and priests right now since I'm finally clear of deadline painting projects, and I'll put up photos when I'm done.
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So is the truck extension to go with a specific GW model? Have you ever had any plans to actually release a truck yourself?
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For the moment it fits with Games Workshop's current Ork Trukk (http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Ork-Trukk) model but in the near future I plan on creating a separate sprue that will turn it into its own vehicle. I'm thinking it'll be a ramshackle version of the M35 2½-ton cargo truck (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M35_2%C2%BD-ton_cargo_truck).
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Looks quite like the UMI Alpha truck from Caravaneer :)
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One of the fun things about these kinds of trucks is that they're designed to be multi-purpose. By default mine will be configured for carrying troops but I intend on providing optional add-ons that create some other arrangements (e.g. anti-aircraft gun).
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Not strictly relevant to casting, but here are a few of the grots done. I will try to take some better photos when I finish the lot.
(If this is not the right place, is there a place I should put them?)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/PDQv5svgB7t0K_iMXHCXp5r870aCbIvfjZJHkr9QcD8=w600-h260-no)
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Wow!
It's amazing to see my work in the wild. Not bad for some miscasts :D
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Nice work! :)
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I've been working on the truck I was talking about:
(http://i.imgur.com/afkjeCEl.jpg)
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Progress!
(http://i.imgur.com/EBuDLEPl.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/HgliYygl.jpg)
Amusingly there was a bit of a delay as I had to take the time to carefully fill the engine compartment with resin - otherwise it could either buckle or fill with silicone during the casting process!
I'm looking forward to the next bit of the construction process as it's going to be pretty much exclusively detailing. Then I've got to design another two axles (as ideally I want the vehicle to be usable without the truck extension kit (http://'http://fox-box.co.uk/product/fox-box-orc-truck-extension-kit/')) and the canopy frame/roll bars.
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Looking good! Will those wheels be fairly as is, or with tyres, or with tracks on the back pair?
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For now the wheels will be pretty much as they are. They're a marginal improvement on the originals (a few minor detail additions and pre-drilled sockets).
In time I'd like to have more wheel designs but I'm still working on ways of getting something suitable. There's a vehicle I'd like to build that I've yet to figure out the wheel situation for so at some point it'll need to be tackled.
I'm considering creating tracked wheels as well but I had a few issues casting the relevant bits for it (amusingly I'm rubbish at making simple open-faced moulds!).
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I've been working on the armament for the truck and the crew. Once they're done then it should be easy to continue on structural things. This is the problem with creating multi-part kits - things need to interlock but one can't glue them together properly during creation.
The truck is going to have a machine gun option and a rocket launcher option. Currently the focus is on creating the machine gun as it's a very specific design (and whilst the rocket launcher is also its design is significantly simpler). As with other things this is where 28mm "Heroic" scale is tricky - things aren't proportional. I have to make a judgement call on which bits should remain prominent and which can be safely shrunk down.
So for reference the machine gun is based on the M60:
(http://i.imgur.com/vcRoQKZl.jpg)
Here it is on the truck (missing its rear iron sight - it hasn't been attached yet):
(http://i.imgur.com/I0OMTqml.jpg)
As you can see the gunner is sitting on a stack of boxes. Currently they're placeholders as they're going to be replaced by ammo tins:
(http://i.imgur.com/JYPx8BAl.jpg)
I'm working on a master at the moment:
(http://i.imgur.com/sjqAvVil.jpg)
Once it's done I'll make some copies and use them for a variety of things. Extra boxes and stuff to decorate vehicles :D
I don't suppose anyone is wondering but the rocket launcher is going to be based on the M202 Flash (https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=m202+flash&es_sm=91&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAWoVChMI6bKO4NuFyAIVrW7bCh0NtwLG&biw=1440&bih=765#).
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(http://www.fretshirt.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/thumbnail/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/f/a/facebook_machine_gun_likes_wf_white-p996.jpg)
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Bonus points if you can make the like-machine-gun as an option, FK. :P
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I reckon I probably could, amusingly!
Alas there's too many other projects to work on for Joker-style weaponry at the moment (maybe one for April 2016..?).
Anyway these guys went in the pot last night and their mould will be getting tested in a few hours:
(http://i.imgur.com/GCPST3Ql.jpg)
They're not really done, per se, but to continue to improve them I need to experiment and I don't really want to mess up what I've done so far.
I'm also trying to decide on whether to add rivets to these:
(http://i.imgur.com/VrqpvdRl.jpg)
(Spot the odd firearm out)
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I've been experimenting with filler for my resin and whilst the first run has a load of bubbles in general the results are promising!
(http://i.imgur.com/9QsiAr9l.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/9QsiAr9.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/yvWcp7Yl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/yvWcp7Y.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/to8lTyTl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/to8lTyT.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/EiJscSJl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/EiJscSJ.jpg)
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It took a while but I finally have a mould for her!
(http://i.imgur.com/38xVWt4l.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/38xVWt4.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/7ciBD6Il.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/7ciBD6I.jpg)
I'm amazed the talons worked out. Utterly gobsmacked.
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Do the chickens have large talons?
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Larger than you might think!
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Now that I've got some ammo boxes for the truck gunner to sit on I can at last get back to getting fine details to fit. Putting big plates together is fairly quick but getting things to fit that can't be glued in place is a pain in the backside. The spacing on the crew-served weapon has been a thorn in my side over the last few days but at last I'm on to putting the alternate weapon in - an M202 Flash rocket launcher!
(http://i.imgur.com/XSIJ970l.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/XSIJ970.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/pRYNsb1l.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/pRYNsb1.jpg)
Of course in reality the spacing wouldn't work at all due to the backblast but I figure it's worth overlooking to get the other main weapon option in there.
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Speaking as someone who knows minimal weapon history beyond 1461, backblast?
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Speaking as someone who knows minimal weapon history beyond 1461, backblast?
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You know how space launches generate an awful lot of heat, pressure, noise, and smoke that splash all over the place when they push a rocket upwards? Something like that.
Here's a Wikipedia article on it (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backblast_area).
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So what you're saying is....Jet fuel can't melt steel beams?
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OK, that's more or less what I'd imagined would be the case :)
(As in what a backblast is. I make no comment on jet fuel and steel beams.)
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Video's all you need. :)
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(http://i.imgur.com/56Id0Ypl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/56Id0Yp.jpg)
My Orc Brute torsos compared to some GW Orks.
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I finally finished my rebel grots -- just one more priest guy to go.
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-UZbggabdUK4/Vo45A3uRWZI/AAAAAAAAPx0/1iRS2yfFmkc/s640/20160107_094632.jpg)
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Nice! Though I have this odd vision of them all speaking French or Spanish for some reason... I'm not sure what grot-Spanish would sound like but I'd be interested to know!
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I finally finished my rebel grots -- just one more priest guy to go.
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-UZbggabdUK4/Vo45A3uRWZI/AAAAAAAAPx0/1iRS2yfFmkc/s640/20160107_094632.jpg)
Nice! I'm going to be making a new mould of these guys in the coming week. I'm still not sure whether to include the RPK and RPG gobbos though or whether to leave them as a separate mould.
Here's something new for my Orc range:
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Nice! I love the idea of extending the Orks' doofy mechanical sensibility to other types of vehicle.
I have finished my last Fox Box model (well, last non-duplicate). Again, the right arm and weapon are added by me; I couldn't figure out how they were supposed to fit on the original model, as I recall. I really like this guy's head; is he meant to look like Robert Duvall? I know that sounds like I'm joking, but I really think it works.
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-suI0eR8gI4E/VpKAWPZbXrI/AAAAAAAAP5A/zc99r-aRMMY/s640/20160110_132337.jpg)
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Video fixed :)
(SMF is fine with unlisted videos, its odd quirk is that you have to put http rather than https in the URL for some reason)
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I couldn't figure out how they were supposed to fit on the original model, as I recall.
Here's what the unmodified priest looks like:
At some point I need to get around to painting one!
I couldn't figure out how they were supposed to fit on the original model, as I recall. I really like this guy's head; is he meant to look like Robert Duvall? I know that sounds like I'm joking, but I really think it works.
You'd have to ask Kev White (http://www.hfminis.co.uk/shop?product=human-male-heads~hfl102&category=accessories~converting) - the heads were available under a royalty free license when I bought them. I'm working on my own heads but I'm not quite there yet. Humans are tricky!
(SMF is fine with unlisted videos, its odd quirk is that you have to put http rather than https in the URL for some reason)
Ah - so the functionality hasn't kept up with YouTube's transition to HTTPS ;)
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Ah, OK. That makes sense; I think maybe I messed up his hand in transit or something. I wound up cutting off the holster and replacing it with a satchel from a Warlord WW2 Soviet infantry sprue, which are my go-to "stick a bag on this to cover up where I've hacked something off" resource.
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The goblins needed a new mould. I decided to cut them into several pieces for (my) convenience:
(http://i.imgur.com/5UnCv06l.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/5UnCv06.jpg)
There's now six of them rather than the original four and a few things were modified slightly (most notably the jaw rebuild on the one on the far left).
I've also got some barrels. I'm just casting these though, they're not my sculpts. Barrels rock!
(http://i.imgur.com/YJoy7b0l.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/YJoy7b0.jpg)
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I still love that your goblins have berets :D
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Awww, cheers! They're adorable in their own ratty way.
I think my human weapon sprue is nearly done:
(http://i.imgur.com/Grxgi80l.jpg)
I've also finished painting my Orc Snow Stinger:
It'll hopefully be up for sale today or tomorrow.
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Nice! I'm always slightly envious of the cool effect of having the turntable, not that I ever do anything pretty enough to put on one :P
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It's nice, ain't it? Couple of quid on eBay!
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...and it's up!
(http://i.imgur.com/OEPycJKl.jpg) (http://fox-box.co.uk/product/fox-box-orc-snow-stinger/)
You can find it here:
http://fox-box.co.uk/product/fox-box-orc-snow-stinger/
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Nicely done :) Also, tweeted the link out!
Wondering what other vehicles could come along the line now... amphibious truck might be fun!
(And do let me know if you ever want anything specifically done in terms of social media stuff or if you ever want to spread out and get a subforum, btw.)
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Nicely done :) Also, tweeted the link out!
Cheers - 'ppreciate it!
Wondering what other vehicles could come along the line now... amphibious truck might be fun!
I want to do some wheel replacements that mean other vehicles can run on snow :D
(And do let me know if you ever want anything specifically done in terms of social media stuff or if you ever want to spread out and get a subforum, btw.)
If I had a subforum would I create a topic for each new release?
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Ooh, trucks with tracks type stuff?
And yes, I mean, you could use the space how you wanted, but you certainly could do. :)
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Yep - like the hummers in Inception :)
If you'd like to setup a subforum for Fox Box I'll do my best to populate it!
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I've sent you a PM running over the details :)
... also I should really watch inception, I never have done :s
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It's a fun little heist movie. Very atmospheric.
Cheers for the setup. The banner is with you and I'll see about some new topics on the morrow.
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JUBAL CASTS THREAD TELEPORT
Welcome to your new home :D
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We've not got any tasty chocolate eggs for you but we do have a 20% off sale on Fox Box branded stuff:
(http://i.imgur.com/61Qv9Fvl.jpg) (http://fox-box.co.uk/product-category/fox-box/)
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Here's a bit of work in progress:
(http://i.imgur.com/CITmbaFl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/CITmbaF.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/qDLamHNl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/qDLamHN.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/jdyg1rvl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/jdyg1rv.jpg)
It pairs with the (soon to be reissued) truck extension kit like this:
(http://i.imgur.com/yNKkii5l.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/yNKkii5.jpg)
There's a few extra images in the album (http://imgur.com/a/uciV1).
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Excellent! Are you all set up and working in the new place now then? :)
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Not quite - my casting rig is setup but needs power. I'm waiting on the electrician to sort it out. Any day now... :-\
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Something to note about the new truck kit - it's designed to fit with other things:
(http://i.imgur.com/HyU0MIml.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/HyU0MIm.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/l8c1Qvsl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/l8c1Qvs.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/rvv51yXl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/rvv51yX.jpg)
It's a big enough kit that it needs to be on several separate sprues so I figure they'll probably be available separately.
(http://i.imgur.com/g4tt4Fxl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/g4tt4Fx.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/Vqauf2Vl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/Vqauf2V.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/mAOtwHDl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/mAOtwHD.jpg)
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Nice stuff! Look forward to seeing more :)
In fact I can think of a use for some of these parts other than the truck itself, if I ever get back to the relevant project...
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Cheers!
Onto the next stage!
So now wheels have been cast, the chassis and axles are ready, the cabin needs a few more rivets, and wait - we need some crew right? Weapons would be a good shout too, I expect.
Here's the first cast from the mould. It needed a few tweaks and a certain prat forgot to remove the pedal masters from the driver's feet before pouring in resin but not bad overall!
(http://i.imgur.com/8m8hDuKl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/8m8hDuK.jpg)
I'm pleased that the fine details of the weapons survived:
(http://i.imgur.com/72JKegJl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/72JKegJ.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/md5bOljl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/md5bOlj.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/Jg4EdQLl.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/Jg4EdQL.jpg)
If you want to replace them with something more post apocalyptic I'm sure you won't struggle. Personally I'm rather fond of the M60 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M60_machine_gun) and M202 FLASH (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M202_FLASH) (which would in no way be safe to mount on a vehicle like this!). I feel like I'm getting better at tweaking weapon proportions to match heroic scale - in the past I've found it difficult to stray from the real world proportions.