As a weird dichotomy, I don't believe Islam or any other religion is violent by nature. I do believe some peoples are more violent but that isn't by nature, more by necessity. Israel arguably has the best and most violent special forces in the world but is Judaism responsible for this? I'd say necessity, or at least perceived necessity on their part if you don't believe it's actually necessary. Practices that go on in Islam such as ritual combat I just think are differences between cultures and are not violent in the sense that they mean to cause conflict but are thought of as a resolution. Basically, we've left dueling behind and they haven't. I don't know which of us was right, I for one would like to see Cameron and Milliband draw pistols at dawn.
*Also, innocence is hugely up for debate. Are the people of these Muslim countries actually doing anything to permanently remove threats like ISIL? Have the Muslim community here called for Abu Hamza to be deported/jailed, are our young Muslims here who know of extremists doing anything to stop them? Not a lot of them. Am I innocent? Using hate speech towards a group of people I don't even know. I don't think I am. I'll freely admit to being a bastard but I am also doing/saying what I think is right and for the benefit of the people I care about. Path to damnation paved with good intentions etc. If you think that people are innocent until they actually do something horrific, I'd argue that's too late to be worrying about innocence.
*This is said with the assumption that you're not using legal innocence of crimes as opposed to whether someone is 'good' or not. If the former is the case then sure, the vast majority are innocent.
As to how I come to my views Penty: I'm irrationally wary of Muslims. Fear turns to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffe...wait that was star wars... But you get the point. But I also do believe that there are more extremists year on year. Which is why I don't just dismiss this as paranoia.
We're going to just agree to disagree on use of force by Israel though I think. I call it justified because of all I've said before, you don't. Which is fine, I can't say there is a definitive right/wrong answer. I'm open to being wrong but I don't think I am. If Israel gets destroyed I'll get to say I told you so but I'll find no solace in that. If Hamas dies out because of casualties sustained from Israel, you'll be right and I'll feel bad that I supported them. There are no 'winners' in this, I'm just hoping my far flung brethren survive and find a time of peace.
@Tom, No I wouldn't hate you if I found out you were Muslim, you seem decent so even if you were, I'd be cool with you. Also it's not particularly a religious war. The perpetrators just happen to be Muslim, if they were Chinese instead, I'd be all hating the Chinese. I care more because they're trying to take out the only Jewish country but they're attacking all over the world, to me this looks like these groups actually want a completely Islamic world and unless they're put down hard, won't stop trying.
As another aside I also respect my enemy. They are the people that most of all are fighting blood and thunder for their beliefs, how could one not respect that? Obviously I think they're misguided and evil but they'd say that of me. (This time just talking about the fighters and extremists, not civvies).
An interesting question would be: would I be okay with Britain fighting all Muslims everywhere on principle? Regrettably I can't find an answer yet. If I was okay with that, I can see that would be really, really bad. Personal views are obviously different from political views, it's not hard to see that that would be terrible for the country.