Exilian

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/spain.png)


So, I mentioned I always thought it would be fun to play as Spain (Carthage crossed with barbarians seemed good). Phoenix said that they are bad, but I tried them out anyway. Sure enough, their unit selection made me want to cry. Just Carthage-lite with some naked guys. Oh and a couple of decent unique units, but they are only available from cities. When a nation that was famed for the prowess of its warriors has RTW's Iberian Infantry as their most easily accessible unit that isn't Town Militia/Peasants, and their only good troops come from a maxed out barracks or a single temple, there is a problem.

Problems are fixed by modding!

More info...

I renamed Spain to Iberia, and then this:

Spoiler

Barracks:

   - Town Militia
   - Caetrati

   - Town Militia
   - Caetrati
   - Scutarii

   - Town Militia
   - Caetrati
   - Scutarii
   - Scutarii Lanceari

   - Town Militia
   - Caetrati
   - Scutarii
   - Scutarii Lanceari
   - Heavy Scutarii

Stable:

   - Caetrati Cavalry

   - Caetrati Cavalry
   - Cantabrian Cavalry
   - Lanceari Cavalry

Range:

   - Slingers

   - Slingers
   - Archers

Celtiberian Barracks:

   - Celtiberian Swordsmen

Temple:

   - Bull Warriors

Skirmishers no longer exist, because they are superseded by Caetrati. These are a more historically accurate version of vanilla's Iberian Infantry. They are lightly armoured infantry who carry a number of pilum-style javelins, a falcata sword (historically adapted by the Romans into the gladius) and a small round shield (a caetra).

Caetrati

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/caetrati.png)

Also replacing Iberian Infantry are the Scutarii. These are in vanilla, but as the best mainline troops available to Spain (and as such only recruitable in cities). In my mod they are weakened, but still better than vanilla Iberian Infantry.

I added Scutarii Lanceari as there is a severe lack of spearmen available to Spain in vanilla. They can't form a phalanx (although I did toy with the idea), but are decent fighters and good against cavalry.

Heavy Scutarii are exactly what their name says. They are more heavily armoured and armed than the standard Scutarii, and so will be useful in the late game to hold out against more powerful enemies than the local competitors.

Heavy Scutarii

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/hscutarii.png)

Caetrati Cavalry are essentially Round Shield Cavalry, but like the Caetrati they carry a few javelins. Similarly, Lanceari Cavalry are pretty much Long Shield Cavalry.

Celtiberian Swordsmen are exactly what their name suggests. Coming from the Celtic-influenced Celtiberian tribes, they have big swords and aren't afraid to use them. They will be recruitable by some factions in an AOR-style system in the minor city barracks too (in Celtiberia).

Screenshots later when I take some good ones ;D .

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/thrace.png)


I recently played the swap game with Thrace and was struck by their limited roster and similar to Spain they felt like Macedon-lite with a bit of Dacia thrown in. While this is a bit more exotic than Carthage and naked fanatics, they still didn't feel like they were a faction with their own identity that would give a memorable experience to play as. So I added some hoplites and some more cavalry. Then things escalated!

More info...

Veteran Hoplites!

Spoiler

(http://sotk.co.uk/spain/thracehoplites.png)

Also, thureophoroi (read weakened heavy peltasts with spears as their secondary weapon). I think I will use these to replace militia hoplites. They are actually marginally better in my opinion (slightly better armour, has a ranged weapon, same spears, although lack phalanx ability) and therefore are more expensive. I'll play a campaign with them replaced and see what its like compared with my game with militia hoplites in instead. They'll have a stronger version (Thorakitai) available to fill the role that I would have used them for as heavy peltasts. They will be a high-level range unit though, rather than from a basic barracks.

Spoiler

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/thureophoroi.png)

First up on the cavalry list are the Getic Lancers (Thrace own Campus Getae, lets give them some Getae horsemen :D ). They fill a similar role to Macedon's light lancers, albeit with a weaker charge. Their shields make up for that difference though.

Spoiler

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/lancers.png)

The second addition is the Thracian Noble Cavalry. I kinda cheated a little here, they are just the General's Bodyguard guys. Excellent shock cavalry, recruitable from a level 3 stables (Hippodrome?).

Spoiler

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/nobles.png)

I'm removing the Greek cavalry, since that spot is filled by the Getic Lancers. However, Getic Lancers will be recruited from a basic stables alongside Militia Cavalry. The second level of stables will add some horse archers, as yet unimplemented. Then finally the third level will add the Thracian Noble Cavalry.

That gives the following roster:

Spoiler

Barracks:

   - Thureophoroi

   - Thureophoroi
   - Falxmen
   - Thracian Hoplites

   - Thureophoroi
   - Falxmen
   - Thracian Hoplites
   - Getic Warriors
   - Phalanx Pikemen

   - Thureophoroi
   - Falxmen
   - Thracian Hoplites
   - Getic Warriors
   - Phalanx Pikemen
   - Thracian Elite Hoplites
   - Bastarnae

Stable:

   - Militia Cavalry
   - Getic Lancers

   - Militia Cavalry
   - Getic Lancers
   - Getic Horse Archers

   - Militia Cavalry
   - Getic Lancers
   - Getic Horse Archers
   - Thracian Noble Cavalry

Range:

   - Peltasts

   - Peltasts
   - Archers

   - Peltasts
   - Archers
   - Thorakitai                  (Ultra-heavy peltasts)

The elite hoplites are those pictured earlier in the thread, they are similar to armoured hoplites belonging to the Greek Cities. Thracian Hoplites will be similar to the standard Greek hoplites.

Excellent work! Now that you've started you cannot stop!  ;D

This is true. Hopefully I won't do my usual running out of motivation trick when I get round to adding these as a custom battle faction to Britannia BC ;) .

Good work SotK. Are you going to put it up for download when you finish?

Of course you'll finish. It's all psychological. ;)

I will yes :) . Its only a small mod so I'm sure I will finish ;) .

As far as a Phalanx goes, the Turdetanii were heavily influenced by both Punic and Hellenic culture. Perhaps they might be a good way to get a phalanx in?

Regarding javelins, I take it you have increased the missile attack to represent that the soliferum was... nasty?

Can't wait to see what else you've been working on.

Hmm. It certainly could work. I know that there was Greek influence, that's why I was thinking about adding phalanx in the first place. You're right though, that's probably a good way to get them in :) .

As for the missiles, armour piercing and good attack ;D .

Very nice. Consider yourself repped. ;)

You are definitely skilled in your marketing. I envy. ;)

Thanks guys!

I was just thinking, would it be a good or bad idea to have more barbarian-style units and a special building to recruit them from rather than recruiting them from temples like in vanilla?

Hmmm, well what units were you thinking?

But I do agree with having a barracks type thing rather than temples. Temples should be for the absolute elite I think.

EDIT* So just the Bull Warriors from the temples and have Celtiberian swordsmen and perhaps archers from some sort of Mustering Hall type thing.

I agree with the both of ye.

Spoiler

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/barracks.png)

Jubal or Marcus, if either of you read this, we need an excited drooling smiley...

Wish I hadn't looked into making it appear on the battle map though. Settlement plans what even?! D:

You've looked at the 3ds Max plan editor?

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=692

Yeah I downloaded that earlier but haven't had time to properly look into it yet. It would be easier if there was an importer to give an idea of where everything else is in the settlement...

I think I've finished the model now anyhow ;D .

Spoiler

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/barracks2.png)

Quote from: Phoenixguard09 on February 13, 2012, 01:37:33 PMJubal or Marcus, if either of you read this, we need an excited drooling smiley...

(http://www.millan.net/minimations/smileys/droolsmiley.gif)      (http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/ii140/Sapbucket/drooling-5.gif)      (http://taflan.org/images/smilies/smiley_drooling.gif)

Very nice, Saw! :)

Added the building ingame :D . Pretty battle map models and unique ui's for it may wait until I have released though.

Other than that I have just a few units left to do, then balancing/fine tuning and then release time :D .

Any news?

Not really, been procrastinating/playing Skyrim/modding Skyrim the last few days. Feeling an RTW mood coming on though, so will work on this soon :) .

Sounds good!

Spain Mod news!

This mod has successfully been rescued from my failing hard drive, and so won't be lost and given up on as I feared!

Huzzah!

Wow, it would have been a real shame to loose all that work, especially on maybe one of the weakest factions of RTW (together with Numidia)! Can I suggest something though? Forget the phalanx... Iberian tribes were known for their mobility. You would neglect this tactical advantage they had by giving them phalanx type units. Aside of that, no other complaints :P

Playing a defensive campaign as Spain to iron out bugs, then I'll do a release. Expect it within the next week.

 ;D
Can't wait for this! 8)

w0000000t

Quote from: debux on July 09, 2012, 06:23:48 PM
w0000000t

Rebalancing lead to a new culture, but that's how I roll...

Anyhow, there is now a release-able mod here, with minimal bugs as far as I have found. Going to playtest some more then release between now and Friday! This release will include some new buildings, however they (with the exception of a certain, important one) won't appear on battle maps just yet. Also Spain won't be awful anymore (although fighting Romans should provide a nice challenge)!

No phalanx yet (sorry Phoenix :P ) but I may add an AOR where Hellenic colonies were historically to allow recruitment of some kind of hoplites there. Cantabrian Archers have become just Archers, without an AOR. This is partly because I can't think of anything that justifies them being Cantabrian as opposed to anything else. Celtiberian Swordsmen come from the Celtiberian Barracks I added, not the temple as the OP says. Other Celtiberian units may/will be added in due course. Caetrati from the first level of barracks could be a little overpowered, but that's what the next day is for discovering.

Scutarii Lanceari from a Large Town barracks was definitely overpowered. To fix this, I added them only at Minor City level. However, I didn't like the feel of this, and also I didn't like how quickly Scutarii became obsolete with a more powerful version available at Minor City level. This is what lead to adding a new culture. I tried to add a fourth city level to the barbarian culture, but only allow the Iberians to build up to it. This worked for a few hours, albeit with an error when I quit the game. I then added in UIs and some stuff, and the error that I was getting on quit became a CTD on campaign start. So now Iberians are a separate culture, because I'm pretty sure that was the only way to get what I wanted. And besides, it makes editing the settlement plans a little easier (if I ever get my head around how to use them).

Can't wait to try it out :)
Will you release over at TWC? I bet you will get some great feedback.
Also, why not update the OP to include the changes you made? That way people who download know exactly what they are getting :)

Quoteseparate culture

How was this accomplished?

Sounds pretty sweet though!  8)

Quote from: comrade_general on July 11, 2012, 01:19:10 AM
How was this accomplished?

First, I copied the barbarian entry in descr_cultures, renamed it to Iberian and added an additional settlement level. I then changed Spain's culture from barbarian to Iberian in descr_sm_factions. Then I opened EDB and used find and replace to replace barbarian with barbarian, iberian. That was the quick part done with.

Next I spent about an hour going through export_buildings in the text folder making a culture specific entry for each building the Iberians have. I then copied the barbarian ui folder into my modfolder's ui folder and called it iberian. Then I changed the prefix of all the images in there from barbarian to iberian. that also took a while.

Now I added settlement plans to the Iberians. Basically I added iberian to all the barbarian entries in descr_settlement_plan (and then added an entry for them in the plan sets list near the end of the file, again using the barbarian set). I also copied the barbarian entries in descr_banners and descr_sm_settlements, adding the extra settlement level for Iberians in the latter.

I then added an Iberian entry wherever there was a relevant Barbarian entry in the other files in the text folder (I think the only ones I needed to change were expanded_bi and menu_english) and added an Iberian copy of the barbarian diplomacy messages in diplomacy.txt.

This gave me a working (albeit silent) Iberian culture in addition to the six already in the game. Pretty sure 7 is the hardcoded limit after reading around though...

To make sound like music and speeches appear I added iberian to the entries for barbarian in descr_sounds_music, descr_sounds_stratmap, descr_sounds_units_confirm, export_descr_sounds_prebattle, export_descr_sounds_stratmap_voice, export_descr_sounds_units_battle_events.

Quote from: ahowl11 on July 11, 2012, 12:33:19 AM
Will you release over at TWC? I bet you will get some great feedback.
Also, why not update the OP to include the changes you made? That way people who download know exactly what they are getting :)

I may do, don't think I've ever posted there before though xD .

And yeah, updating the OP now :) .

Very impressive! Nice work!

Well done SotK, your reticence with regards to the phalanx unit can be forgiven. :P

OK now a wild link has appeared! (http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/spainmod-v1.0.zip)

It's super effective!

Do you mind if I use it for some development of my own? (better placed, do I have your permission to use it in my own project?)

Yeah sure, just mention me in the readme or whatever if you release it :) .

It just might take me a while :P I haven't even started, but I plan to do so in a week or two (I have to attend unfinished business with working for TGW at TWC)

And thanks!

Units look great! Definitely think you should join TWC and release there, but that's just me. The more exilian members we have at TWC, the more interest we gain I believe :)

Well, we who are at TWC can always make a thread there for him. It's always a subtle balance between having enough presence there to be visible and at the same time not having so much there that nobody has any reason to come here, I think.

Hmmm, good point. Well I would be honored to have the privilege to release it there. Of course with everyone's permission. I would include the link to the thread here at exilian, that way they have to come here to download :)

Sadly I can't get the blasted campaign to work. :/

Units look great in battle though! Wish I could go back and include this in my previous releases. ;)

One thing: are the Carthaginian Long Shields supposed to read as "Iberian Heavy Cav"?

Feel free to do that ahowl :) .

You getting an error or just CTD? And nope, is there a limit on unit name length or something?

Oh that campaign bug. That is weird. And infuriating. It wasn't there this morning when I was testing my city models. Now to try and remember what I changed...

Oh, no I meant all of "Cavalry" I was just being lazy. :P I got ya.

No it freezes just after the campaign loading bar starts up; no errors, ktm's, etc. RTW freezes up altogether and I have to kill it with TM. Tried some of the usual mumbo-jumbo but to no avail.

This is really strange, I've removed the only changes I made since I last had it working and still have freezing. Might want to hold off on a TWC announcement :P .

Will do, but sadly I get the same loading problem, the game just freezes and stops loading. I had to ctrl-alt-delete to get out of there and it said that the rtw.exe wasn't responding.

I have no clue what it could be. If it's fixable, I will wait till it gets fixed before I release it for you on TWC

Got the source of the problem found anyway. When I set the game to use the model I made for the Iberian fort instead of the barb fort it freezes. I don't understand why just yet since it was working earlier :s .

Can you make a small little patch to fix it?

Yeah. Coming up once I triple check everything. *waves magical exporter script wand*

Good work on the problem-solving, Kingson!

Wild hotfix also appeared (http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/spainmod-hotfix.zip).

I'll upload a working full download tomorrow, its midnight here and last time it took me an hour to upload on this bad home internet :( .

Great! I will wait to release on TWC until you have the full download. Great work!

Full download of the working version is now available! Get it here (http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/spainmod-v1.0.1.zip)!

A release at TWC!
Tell me what you think.
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?p=11712848#post11712848

I like it :) . Thank you very much!

You are welcome :)

Sorry for not having tested it, I just downloaded it to check it in the future :P

Good to know you were able to find the solution though (saved me some time ;D )

I played some RTW!

;D

Great to see this being done, spain in vanilla was highly disappointing! Downloaded and played a bit and all seems to work fine for me, though loading is a bit slower than normal, but that's not really an issue.

One thing I have found though is an inability to build fleets. I have ports at Asturica, Scallabis, Numantia and Carthago Nova but none of them seem to be able to recruit boats like in the unit descriptions. Since it hasn't been mentioned I thought I'd also ad that farms are showing a warning on description text.

But overall I love it! Keep up the good work!

Playing that swap game made me want to mod again. Mainly Thrace, so I changed some stuff. I also fixed the boat bug, I derped.

(http://sociophobicme.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/raisins_face.jpg?w=652&h=390)

For example, Thracian Hoplites (thinking of them becoming elite hoplites or somesuch).

Spoiler

(http://sotk.co.uk/spain/thracehoplites.png)

They look amazing mate looks like they fit seamlessly into the game :)

Definitely change to the javelin anim for short/medium pikes, it's a simple trick but looks so much better. Looks nice though :)

I took account of the above advice and messed around with the hoplites some more.

Spoiler

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/hoplites.png)

Also, thureophoroi (read weakened heavy peltasts with spears as their secondary weapon). I think I will use these to replace militia hoplites. They are actually marginally better in my opinion (slightly better armour, has a ranged weapon, same spears, although lack phalanx ability) and therefore are more expensive. I'll play a campaign with them replaced and see what its like compared with my game with militia hoplites in instead. They'll have a stronger version (Thorakitai) available to fill the role that I would have used them for as heavy peltasts. They will be a high-level range unit though, rather than from a basic barracks.

Spoiler

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/thureophoroi.png)

Keep it up Sawman! ;D

With the foot lineup sorted, I will add some horsemen to better match the historical cavalry prowess of the tribes in the region!

Really good!  I applaud to you!

Thanks :) .

First up on the cavalry list are the Getic Lancers (Thrace own Campus Getae, lets give them some Getae horsemen :D ). They fill a similar role to Macedon's light lancers, albeit with a weaker charge. Their shields make up for that difference though.

Spoiler

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/lancers.png)

The second addition is the Thracian Noble Cavalry. I kinda cheated a little here, they are just the General's Bodyguard guys. Excellent shock cavalry, recruitable from a level 3 stables (Hippodrome?).

Spoiler

(http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/nobles.png)

I'm removing the Greek cavalry, since that spot is filled by the Getic Lancers. However, Getic Lancers will be recruited from a basic stables alongside Militia Cavalry. The second level of stables will add some horse archers, as yet unimplemented. Then finally the third level will add the Thracian Noble Cavalry.

That gives the following roster:

Spoiler

Barracks:

   - Thureophoroi

   - Thureophoroi
   - Falxmen
   - Thracian Hoplites

   - Thureophoroi
   - Falxmen
   - Thracian Hoplites
   - Getic Warriors
   - Phalanx Pikemen

   - Thureophoroi
   - Falxmen
   - Thracian Hoplites
   - Getic Warriors
   - Phalanx Pikemen
   - Thracian Elite Hoplites
   - Bastarnae

Stable:

   - Militia Cavalry
   - Getic Lancers

   - Militia Cavalry
   - Getic Lancers
   - Getic Horse Archers

   - Militia Cavalry
   - Getic Lancers
   - Getic Horse Archers
   - Thracian Noble Cavalry

Range:

   - Peltasts

   - Peltasts
   - Archers

   - Peltasts
   - Archers
   - Thorakitai                  (Ultra-heavy peltasts)

The elite hoplites are those pictured earlier in the thread, they are similar to armoured hoplites belonging to the Greek Cities. Thracian Hoplites will be similar to the standard Greek hoplites.

I am happy with the (deliberately) varied infantry roster, that represents the blend of barbarian culture and Hellenism that vanilla failed to capture.

Maybe I will turn this into a "fix factions failed by vanilla" mod :D .

Wunderbar  :)

This is looking more and more awesome! Beefed up Spain and Thrace in the same mod? What could be better!

OK then, implementation is done, now to run a couple of test campaigns with new Thrace!

So far, I am sad with my hoplites for being bad.

Or is it just falxmen being ridiculously strong? :P

I made the OP pretty :D

At some point, a frontpage newspost about releasing the Thracian stuff would be good - will give Othko something to tweet about at least!  :)

Excellent!

I will write a news post when I release, which should be some point in the next few days.

So,how is it going?

^ What he said.  :P

I just realised I forgot about this, I'll try and get it released soon :P .

Hells to the yes. :)

OK, motivation has struck! Lets do this!

Quote from: comrade_general on October 08, 2013, 03:54:55 PM
(http://sociophobicme.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/raisins_face.jpg?w=652&h=390)

I had to go out before it was ready to upload... Soon!

I learnt about -ai, and ran a campaign yesterday. I was following the Julii so I didn't manage to reach the conclusion since Spain eliminated them on their way to conquering all of Italy and starting on the Brutii's stuff in Greece...

In an earlier game I was following Macedon, and Thrace demolished them. In the second game Macedon fought Thrace off and Thrace ended up just fighting Scythia until the Brutii came. I feel like they are nicely balanced, but Spain need work!

You only just found out about -ai? It's like the most useful command line ever!

I did it! Version 1.1 is released! Thracian improvements galore!

Download here. (http://www.sotk.co.uk/spain/spainmod-v1.1.0.zip)

Do a frontpage!

(Seriously, we need something new on the frontpage, we've still got the C&M day stuff from mid-February up.)