0.6-1.0

[ahowl11]

Alright team, it's time to get down to some serious business. We have had a lot of discussion and ideas lately and now it's time to organize it all into a set plan for our next public release. Here I will lay out the order in which I'd like to continue the mod for a 1.0 version.

0.6
Delete All ahistorical units
Completely Remove Senate from game
Remove Scipii, and Brutii from campaign
Convert Thrace to Illyria
Convert Britons to Celtic Tribes
Change Egypt to Ptolemaic Empire *Should the culture stay Egyptian or should we make them Greek?
Change Spain to Iberia
Change Scythia to Sarmatia
Rename romans_julii, romans_brutii, romans_scipii, and romans_senate to rome, hellenic_kingdoms, greek_states, and independent_peoples
Edit descr_strat accordingly

0.7
Add in New Faction units (Depending on the availability of Algaman and TBTWB we could end up adding premade units.. I am hoping that while we work on 0.6 that they can be making the new units for 0.7)
Edit Mercenary Pools
Start editing Economy
Add new culture: Nomad, for Sarmatia

0.8
Add in New Mercenary Units
Create AOR system
Start adding in new traits/ancillaries
Continue editing Economy
Add Loyalty

0.9
Add in New AOR units
Start adding government system
Continue adding traits/ancillaries
Continue editing economy
Add Hording

1.0
Finish Government system
Finish Traits/ancillaries
Finish Economy

Also, in between all of these versions we can continue to look for mini mods and other things, like EB's Egyptian/Seleucid Portrait pack, Milners African Portraits, V.T. Marvins Spoils of War etc

Let me know your thoughts. Agree? Disagree?

[Bercor]

Seems like a good plan.

Ptolemaic Empire culture should be greek. Giving them the egyptian culture would be both unhistorical and stupid, because we would be wasting a culture slot.

[ahowl11]

Okay that means we will have an unused culture which we could make Nomad. However this means that we would need to change all the buildings etc for the Nomad culture. It would be advanced work.
I also have had the idea of making Iberia part of the Carthaginian culture.

[Bercor]

You might want to talk with an Iberian history specialist for that.

[Solon de Atenas]

We are in the same point, I mean, now we should change internal names for some faction and create new cultures in RTRA III.

hmmm about iberian. I think that I can help...

Iberian property was people who lived in mediterranean costline from Gades to Emproion. Almost the entire andalusian region was iberian people homeland and currently provinces of Valencia and Cataluña. These peoples were the most ancient people of iberian peninsula and they was the most involved too. Iberian peoples had a huge influence of phoenicians and greek because they had trading by hundred years between them.

The problem is, what tribe do you want to create to RTR? Because, the entire peninsula hadn´t a common culture like gaul peoples. In spain there are three kind of ethnic groups. Iberian property, Celtiberian and Celtic peoples.

Celtiberian and Celtic peoples in Iberian peninsula are difficult to explain because they aren´t celtc property for a few and very importants reasons. The first is that they belong to ancient migrations before hallsthatt, so, they are indoeuropean peoples and slightly similar to gaulish but they aren´t...

So, Celtic peoples of iberian peninsula like Lusitanians or Galacians, asturian, etc are indoeuropean peoples that they arrived before hallsthat cultures and other european celtic cultures. The group know like celtiberian have the same problem but this, in addition its influenced by iberian culture.

And iberian culture is a original culture from iberian peninsula but its the most influenciated by phoenicians and greeks.

Obviously, gaul peoples were influences by greeks in ancient times (greek pottery in gaul, etc), but iberian peoples were totally modified by them...

Exampkles of iberian, celtiberian and celtic peoples in spain:

Iberian: turdetani, bastetani, edetani, south-carpetani, etc
celtiberian: celtiberi, carpetani-north, vaccei, arevaci, etc
Celtic: lusitani, galacians, asturians, etc

Vasci??? The origing of vascii tribe ist unknow and strongly disscuss...
in my opinion was people proto-iberian. the reason is that there are iberian culture places in aquitania region, but these places were isolated from phoenician and greek influence (costline). For this, Vascii peoples and other ancient iberian tribes from atlantic costline were isolated and ceturies later, seem different from iberian peoples from mediterranean costline.

So, celtic and celtiberian can use barbarian culture but iberian its a problem because carthaginian culture is wrong, greek culture is wrong and barbarian is wrong. Iberian should be:

Postraits: Mix beetween barbarian and greek portraits.
Houses: Like carthaginian tipology but white colour and with greek/barbarian cityplan
Temples and art: totally new but with greek influence

for now, its all.

[The Sloth]

So basically, unless we create an entirely new culture for Iberia, with customized buildings and so on, we'd better keep them barbarian.

1) I'm against including religion. Different beliefs don't seem to have been that big of a deal back then, and it causes some wierd gameplay issues.

2) If we're including nomadic culture, we might consider making Numidia nomadic as well. What do our historians say?

3) Regarding Egypt, it would be nice to have a distinct Greek-Egyptian feel for the faction, but I admit I have no idea how that could be done. With RTW's mechanics, they will automatically look like either Athenians or like mummies, neither of which is realistic. If we do keep them Egyptian, we should at least give them Greek character portraits and names. After all, they were a hellenic elite ruling a native Egyptian people.

[Bercor]

So basically, unless we create an entirely new culture for Iberia, with customized buildings and so on, we'd better keep them barbarian.

1) I'm against including religion. Different beliefs don't seem to have been that big of a deal back then, and it causes some wierd gameplay issues.

2) If we're including nomadic culture, we might consider making Numidia nomadic as well. What do our historians say?

3) Regarding Egypt, it would be nice to have a distinct Greek-Egyptian feel for the faction, but I admit I have no idea how that could be done. With RTW's mechanics, they will automatically look like either Athenians or like mummies, neither of which is realistic. If we do keep them Egyptian, we should at least give them Greek character portraits and names. After all, they were a hellenic elite ruling a native Egyptian people.

I agree, we might aswell leave the iberians with the barbarian culture.

1) I'm with you, let's leave religion out of this mod.

2) It's a possibility. I think they fit in the punic culture nicely, though.

3) Yeah, it's a shame that the portraits are linked to culture and not to faction. I reckon one way to give the multicultural feel to the faction is through the native troops. However, between the ancient egyptian portraits and the hellenic ones, I would go with the latter.

[ahowl11]

How many cultures are we allowed to have in RTW? To be honest I hate just having a Barbarian Culture. I wish we could have Celtic, Germanic, and the others as their own.
Also the religion feature is not for actual religion. We can change it to represent culture like a lot of other mods do. The common solution is to have Western Civilized, Eastern Civilized, and Barbarian.

[Bercor]

I believe the max number it's 6 cultures.

[Mausolos of Caria]

Well Roman is Barbarian, isn't it? That's what Pyrrhos said 

[Bercor]

Well, then we might aswell have only two cultures: greeks and barbarians.

[ahowl11]

It's possible to have 7 cultures.
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?34622-How-to-Add-a-New-Culture

Currently we have:

1. Roman
2. Greek
3. Barbarian
4. Eastern
5. Egyptian
6. Carthaginian
7. Nomad *Added

Now this is how I see it. Why have a Carthaginian culture? It's exactly the same as the eastern culture. So scrap Carthaginian and we have another slot.

Then there is Egyptian. If we change Egypt to be Greek, we then have yet another slot available. So the list would look like:

1. Roman
2. Greek
3. Barbarian
4. Eastern
5. Nomad *Added
6. ?
7. ?

Here is a list of potential options:

Celtic and Germanic and leave Barbarian to represent Iberians, Illyrians, Dacians and Thracians
Indian for when we make the Mauryan faction campaign
Iberian so they are not resembled as Barbarians

Thoughts?

[The Sloth]

I haven't played RS1 for years, but I believe they had Egyptian culture with Greek character portraits.

The idea of culture is not what their settlements or UI look like, but their historical roots and ties to other factions that share the same culture. And Carthage hasn't really all that much in common with Parthia, or has it? Besides, you'd end up with "eastern" culture in the most western part of the map.

And I'm still against religion. If we change it into culture, we end up with something even more vague than the seven culture groups, since there can only be three religions. The feature was poorly implemented in the first place: if you try to convert a settlement to your religion/whatever, you'll end up with situations like a village with 400 inhabitant revolting against your full stack of Chosen Agema Praetorians of Sparta, and there is nothing you can do about it. It's good for pissing off the player, and nothing more.

[ahowl11]

Okay well it saves time and effort by not adding the religion feature.

As for cultures should we keep the Ptolemies Egyptian but add Greek looks or should we completely make them Greek?

[b257]

I found something interesting that might allow us to Utilize the Egyptian culture:
http://www.eternalegypt.org/EternalEgyptWebsiteWeb/HomeServlet?ee_website_action_key=action.display.module&language_id=1&story_id=51&module_id=301&ee_messages=0001.flashrequired.text

Not much but it could give the Egyptians a more distinct culture.