Author Topic: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW  (Read 512 times)

Jubal

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Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« on: May 26, 2018, 07:39:37 PM »
So, I've been thinking about possible additions to SoaW: here are some of my ideas for what could turn up in future versions, do take or leave as you see fit :)

Extra Characters
There are so many options here! I'll just go through a few that I've thought quite a bit about.

Rogue
Melee 80, Magic 30, Archery 60, Health 80. Starts with a throwing knife, a rope, and +1 speed compared to most characters.
The rope (or it could also be a smoke bomb) is a special item with no attack that basically works the same as the teleport staff's mana ability. This means the rogue is very quick and can maneuver easily but also relatively fragile and doesn't have great starting stats. Possibly the character should have an extra boost to backstab damage, maybe instead of the +1 speed.

Paladin
Melee 80, Magic 50, Archery 50, 100 start health. Has some extra defensive abilities: possibly a sword that gives +1 shielding with each kill, plus regenerates 5hp per battle.

Dwarf
80/60/70, 120 health. Starts with a pickaxe weapon (axe-type, 16dmg, creates bombs with mana like the bomb bag as special). Lowish stats but tough and good at blowing things up, basically.

Extra Room Ideas
  • Castle: tavern users. There could be 2-3 different options for people you can find in the castle tavern and pay to accompany you (a dwarf, a bushido, a third sister who's a warrior-princess) - they'd need to be a lot tougher than eg castle guards or they'd die too quickly, but having more of a "companion character" could be fun in 1p games sometimes.
  • Castle: wizard's study. With a high powered wizard who's got some imps loose that need getting rid of. Maybe kind of like the hornet room, but you have to take them down in a certain period of time or they all reset to being alive again to make the challenge harder?
  • Dungeon: mimic room. This would have a bunch of barrels and boxes and a couple of chests. Most items in the room are normal, but one or two will either explode or turn out to be mimics and attack you back when you interact with them.
  • Dungeon: sewer room. This would have 2-3 slimes in, like smaller baby versions of the slime king, without the crown attack but still throwing slime blobs everywhere and with the close-quarters slime jump attack.
  • Catacomb: Restless Ghost. A room with a ghost and a special type of chest that can’t be unlocked with a key. You need to bring the ghost a special item from somewhere else on the level (maybe an amulet or necklace or something that was important to it in life), and only then will it unlock the chest.
  • Catacomb: Vampire Hunter. Another adventurer found her way down and wants to prove herself by slaying a vampire. If you agree to help, she’ll follow you (only on this level, not through the portal) until either she dies or you kill a Vampire with her in the room, at which point she’ll give you a reward item and teleport out.
  • Ice Mountain: dwarf’s hall. A dwarf blacksmith who has a tunnel to a bonus room which is his family tomb: if you go and retrieve an heirloom (past a load of traps of all 3 types and maybe a couple of golem-type monsters), he’ll make & give you a super-extra powerful runestone (like 3x the effect of a normal one), of type depending on your class (blacksmith for the melee characters, ranger for the archers, warlock for the wizards)
  • Ice Mountain: Skiing. A room which, apart from a little path around the walls, is extra super slippy, such that you basically can’t stop moving until you hit the other side. Have an obstacle course of traps etc in the middle, and a reward item if you ski through all the checkpoints to the other side.
  • Desert: oasis. You can choose to drink the water: it will permanently cure/protect from thirst effects BUT will give you one of Poison(1b), Hypochondria, or Reversed Controls(1b).
  • Desert: medusa's lair. Only for levels where medusa isn't the final boss. This would be a room containing 1 medusa to fight, and a bunch of human soldier statues of some kind (maybe castle-type, or a "good" skin variant of the desert swordsmen), who will join your side if you un-petrify them.

Extra Item Ideas
  • Archmage's Emblem - rare item, gives a +30% boost to magic, similar frequency to the Warrior's emblem, found in chests. Gives mage players something to hope to find even if they're *really* unlucky on potion selection.
  • Alchemist's Visor. - gives you the special ability to be immune to bomb blasts from the Master Blaster challenge.
  • Summoning staff - 7dmg, summons some sort of flying spirit that fights at range with 6dmg orbs for 2-3 mana. This would be a more durable (because less close combat and immunity to floor traps) option compared to the castle guards.
  • Rod of Asclepius (greater healing staff) - 6dmg, heals 15hp + cures poison to all allies in the room as well as player. Would be really useful for general-style play.
  • King Cobra Staff - 7dmg, poison-buffs the current weapon of all allies in the room. Because an army of poison-buffed castle guards would be really fun.
  • Runecaster's staff - 8dmg, turns any runestone into another random type for 2 mana.
  • General's Sword - 7dmg, rage attack boosts ally attack by 20% for the rest of the battle.
  • Sword of the Heavens - 8dmg, rage attack summons a single meteor (like the ones from the meteor staff).
  • Assassin's bow - 35dmg, 15% chance of doubled damage (separate to crits, so if you have a crit + damage double it will do 4x).
  • Scroll of Call Monsters - Makes some random monsters appear. Potentially very dangerous if you trigger it early in the game - potentially useful if you need something to fight or you need a distraction for some enemies, though.
  • Scroll of Heroism - Makes you invulnerable to all attacks except those dealt by bosses for one battle (so you can either get a free battle victory, or do a boss fight whilst being able to ignore the minions).
  • Pangolin Pandora: gives 15% damage reduction (stacks with shielding, so you get 65% damage reduction if you're shielded and have the pet).
  • Octopus Olivia: Goes and opens blue chests, including if they're behind rocks etc (so then you know if it's worth going to them and getting the items).
  • Skunk Sammy: Occasionally sprays a stink cloud, which causes confusion to one enemy at a time (and doesn't work on bosses).
  • Panda Pei: Makes fire and ice effects wear off in half the time.
  • Cow Cody: +20% extra damage to rage attacks.


Misc Extras
  • Tavern barkeep/drunk: just have a regular character in the tavern, because it's still weird the place being empty.
  • Level-appropriate traders: dwarfs on the Ice Mountain, either some kind of bedouin-like types or maybe djinn-like things for the desert level.
  • A post-credits scene of returning the Tar to the goblins or something: it feels like the "wrap-up" at the end of the game is a bit rushed at the moment with no ending visuals other than flying home
The duke, the wanderer, the philosopher, the mariner, the warrior, the strategist, the storyteller, the wizard, the wayfarer...

bigosaur

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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #1 on: August 16, 2018, 02:50:23 PM »
Rogue
Melee 80, Magic 30, Archery 60, Health 80. Starts with a throwing knife, a rope, and +1 speed compared to most characters.
The rope (or it could also be a smoke bomb) is a special item with no attack that basically works the same as the teleport staff's mana ability. This means the rogue is very quick and can maneuver easily but also relatively fragile and doesn't have great starting stats. Possibly the character should have an extra boost to backstab damage, maybe instead of the +1 speed.

I'm working on this with some minor twists. I gave him 100 archery because playing without a single skill at 100 makes him do very little damage. The Twisted Dagger is great for 80% melee at the start of the game: 16 dmg for throw/attack, but other melee weapons do low damage so the combat gets a little bit boring.

I scrapped the rope idea. I tried it out, but having the ability to teleport across the room at will is too OP. I also tried a variant where you need to build up rage to use it, but the throwing dagger is really slow to build up rage (basically, only when you use the backstab/knockdown attack, which is rare).

I gave him +1 speed and it feels great to play.

Now, the only thing I'm not sure how to do is to classify him as Melee or Archery because of the Hard Mode achievement. He uses melee at start, but has 100% archery skill, so I cannot decide. Any thoughts?

« Last Edit: August 16, 2018, 03:17:44 PM by bigosaur »

Jubal

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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #2 on: August 17, 2018, 10:09:05 AM »
Hm, I think it could be either. It maybe depends mostly on what other characters you're planning, but I'd maybe lean towards archery, especially if you're planning another true melee character.

Quote
I also tried a variant where you need to build up rage to use it, but the throwing dagger is really slow to build up rage (basically, only when you use the backstab/knockdown attack, which is rare).
Are you sure this wouldn't work? I think I'd still find that a really nice special ability to have - it would make the rage building potions and the bull pet really helpful for the rogue, and you could use switching weapons in combat for a bit to build it up for a one-off when you needed to use it to teleport into hidden areas. Obviously you've been able to test it and I haven't, but I actually like the idea of it being a rage buildup ability and I think there are enough tactical options to make that useful. I think the trouble with only giving the rogue a speed boost to start with is that that's something any other character could happen to get on level 1, so they lack anything obviously special to the character type.
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bigosaur

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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #3 on: August 17, 2018, 11:20:26 AM »
Hm, I think it could be either. It maybe depends mostly on what other characters you're planning, but I'd maybe lean towards archery, especially if you're planning another true melee character.

Yes, more melee heroes are planned, but not sure if all will be added: Paladin, Dwarf, Female Knight.

Quote
I think the trouble with only giving the rogue a speed boost to start with is that that's something any other character could happen to get on level 1, so they lack anything obviously special to the character type.

Well, if you get another speed boost on level 1 you would be even faster. The difference between 7 and 8 speed is still significant.

But I do agree, there's needs to be something more that would make it special.

BTW, I have also given him the Scout Ring (see foes beyond doors) from the very start. But maybe having something more would be a good idea.

Jubal

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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #4 on: August 17, 2018, 10:24:50 PM »
True - +1 speed definitely does make a difference, it would just be nice to have an ability that feels more "new" I guess.
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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #5 on: August 17, 2018, 10:35:02 PM »
True - +1 speed definitely does make a difference, it would just be nice to have an ability that feels more "new" I guess.

I was thinking a lot about this today. There's an ability that works really well for a rogue sneaking and evading enemies, and it's tied to the rogue sword. Perhaps this hero should always start with that sword. Although this could be OP.

Maybe he can get that ability with all weapons - instead of having the weapon's regular rage attack, he would always do the sneak (turn into barrel) and get "surprise attack" bonus.

Edit: I could also tweak the knife throwing to slowly build up rage (just like arrows do).

P.S. I also though about lockpicking ability, but that would make the fox and keys useless. So, I gave him 5 keys to start with instead.

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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #6 on: August 17, 2018, 10:49:10 PM »
One way you could do lockpicking would be letting him use up keys (as well as/instead of bombs) to open regular non-key doors, which would allow the rogue to sneak around the level a lot more and escape bad combats better (but at a significant cost as you'd potentially be giving up on unlocking so many chests). I think always having the rogue sword would be OP on early levels. A bonus on throwing weapons like allowing throws to build up range would also be quite a cool feature though, I'd definitely be happy with that as an idea.
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bigosaur

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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #7 on: August 17, 2018, 11:08:10 PM »
One way you could do lockpicking would be letting him use up keys (as well as/instead of bombs) to open regular non-key doors, which would allow the rogue to sneak around the level a lot more and escape bad combats better (but at a significant cost as you'd potentially be giving up on unlocking so many chests). I think always having the rogue sword would be OP on early levels. A bonus on throwing weapons like allowing throws to build up range would also be quite a cool feature though, I'd definitely be happy with that as an idea.

Alright, I think it's shaping up pretty good. Here's my idea:

- stats: 80 melee, 100 ranged, 20 magic
- rage attack for all weapons gives the same effect as the Rogue Sword (drawback: cannot use Ice Hammer) or maybe the effect will only work for main weapon, and you can still use the regular weapon's rage attack when off-hand
- 60 HP (because rage effect is OP)
- no speed bonus (regular 6 speed like everyone) because rage effect is OP
- starting weapon: twisted knife (does a nice 16 dmg when thrown, 16+40 for backstab and 16+40+100 for sneak backstab: hard to pull off because of really short range)
- starts without keys or bombs. Instead has a unique "Lockpick Set" item that costs 4 mana to use and unlocks regular and locked doors (does not work with boss doors and blocked doors like the secret forest area and the One Coin Shop treasure room).
- I would also remove the Scout Ring effect I have given him previously, because with Lockpick you can scout rooms manually when needed :) and the actual ring and the related potion would still be useful

Unless you have something else to add/remove/tweak, I would program him like this.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2018, 11:14:22 PM by bigosaur »

Jubal

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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #8 on: August 17, 2018, 11:14:12 PM »
OK, sure, sounds great - will need playtesting, but definitely sounds sufficiently clear/unique in playstyle and it should play for a nice, uhm, rogue like roguelike game! :)
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bigosaur

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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #9 on: September 06, 2018, 06:54:16 PM »
Catacomb: Vampire Hunter. Another adventurer found her way down and wants to prove herself by slaying a vampire. If you agree to help, she’ll follow you (only on this level, not through the portal) until either she dies or you kill a Vampire with her in the room, at which point she’ll give you a reward item and teleport out.

I started to work on this one today. I'm reusing the castle guard captain unit, but giving her a different color palette and the ice sword (I tried with the Retaliator and some other weapons, but this one looks best - and it also makes her quite deadly).



I have some problems writing her dialogue. Everything I try feels bland and stiff. I'm trying to evoke a feeling like she'd like to be a famous vampire hunter, but it's her first time down in the catacombs and she feels overwhelmed with the odds of doing it all by herself. Maybe something along the lines of "help me survive until I find a vampire to kill" or "could you take care of the other types of monsters", esp. since the player has to fight the bats as well if you attack a shop (killing the vampire boss would also count, but the player is more likely to just attack and kill the vampiress shop keeper). I have a general feeling of what it should look like, but cannot put it into words nicely.

Since it was your idea for this room, did you maybe have some idea what would she say to the player?

Help!  ;D

Jubal

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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #10 on: September 06, 2018, 07:41:47 PM »
What's the maximum amount of text you want to have? I find it hard to visualise what a reasonable quantity is for this sort of thing.
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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #11 on: September 06, 2018, 08:22:44 PM »
What's the maximum amount of text you want to have? I find it hard to visualise what a reasonable quantity is for this sort of thing.

There's no limit really. I can easily break it into multiple sections. For example, this is the text for the Skeleton Archer quest (Eye of Ramana)

Quote
Centuries ago, while I was still alive, I had a wizard friend, who cast a spell on me, protecting me from any form of mind control.

When the necromancer raised me from the dead, I resisted becoming his servant.

I’m free now, but I’m blind and thus lost in these catacombs forever...

There’s a magical artifact called The Eye of Ramana, which I can use to restore my sight.It’s in the tomb of the giant king, in the old part of the catacombs.

See that locked door? It leads into the tomb. I don't have a key and it's too dangerous for me to go inside by myself.

Lead me to The Eye and I will be forever grateful.

Oh, one more thing. If I happen to die along the way, you might want to defeat the necromancer and take his magic staff to raise me back from the dead.

This one is the longest in the game. Of course, the shorter it is, the better, but don't be afraid to make it longer if it means it would have more flavor.

Another example, Amanda (Pyromancer quest), says this:

Quote
My brother lives inside the castle. I need to get back to him, but I'm afraid of the goblins.

My brother is a powerful pyromancer. If you help me, I'm sure he'll return the favor.

Can I come with you?



I feel like 3 to 6 sentences is the best (long enough to add details, while still short enough not to "scare" the players).

Jubal

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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #12 on: September 06, 2018, 10:54:26 PM »
Hm, OK, here are some options/ideas:

Vampire Slayer 1: Oathsworn
Quote
Hey!

Some years ago, my village was destroyed by a rampaging vampire lord.

Since then I've sworn revenge on them, so I came down here to hunt down some vampires.

There are many dangers down here, though. I need a fellow adventurer to help me complete my quest.

Help me kill a vampire and I will ensure you are rewarded.

Vampire Slayer 2: Professional
Quote
Hey!

I want to become a famous vampire hunter!

I heard there were undead down in these catacombs, and came here to hunt a vampire down.

But there are too many skeletons around, I need someone else to fight alongside.

Do you want to team up? Help me kill a vampire and I'll make it worth your while.

Vampire Slayer 3: Out of her depth/Funny
Quote
Hey!

I came down here because I wanted to become a mighty vampire slayer.

But there are a lot of skeletons... and I'm afraid of the dark...

...I need someone to help me survive down here. You'll do!

Let's go kill a vampire so I can achieve my dreams! I'll reward you if we kill one.
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bigosaur

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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2018, 10:11:35 AM »
Hm, OK, here are some options/ideas:

Awesome! I'll mixed up something from those (hope you don't mind). Here's what it looks like now:

Quote
I heard there were undead down in these catacombs, and came here to hunt a vampire down. I'm a famous vampire hunter, you know!

Well... to be honest... not really. I have yet to kill my first one...

You see, I'm not afraid of the Vampires. But those skeletons and mages are creeping me out. I need someone else to fight alongside...

Want to help me kill a vampire? I'll make it worth your while.

Any grammar errors I should fix? (I cannot tell if "I have yet to kill" or "I'm yet to kill" is the proper wording).

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Re: Jubal's Ideas for SoaW
« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2018, 12:35:24 PM »
Looks great! Either is fine - I think "have yet to" is the slightly more common usage :)

My other thought is that visually, keeping all the gold in the colour scheme IMO makes her still look a bit too much like a castle guard captain. I wonder if silver armour might work better? I could play around with making a couple of colour variants as ideas if that'd help.


I've also been trying to game through even more character ideas in my head lately (trying to work out how one could do a bard, especially) and I've got a couple of new skinpacks ready that I need to upload. :)
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